INTERESTING INFO

[POINTY STICKS]

Seems that the numbers of both hunters and bow hunters across NS are on the decline. But I found this link off the NSH site to be very informative. Now is there anything that bow hunters can do to increase our numbers or is hunting as we know it coming to an end?

heres the link

gov.ns.ca/natr/wildlife/LGMAMS/largemam04.htm#deer

[alpo]

"same as it never was" is how i see our hunting traditions. What I mean by that is that hunting has always been an neccessity, for mankind to provide food for their families.
But we humans found that there is more than one way to skin a cat (or pig , or cow...), so 'hunting' was reduced to a way to suppliment our food supply, rather than being a primary resorce.
I have typed these words before, but we no longer need to hunt for food, nor would we even be able to legally harvest enough food to make the time & money spent balence out in favour of hunting.
So hunting as recreation, to satisfy that predetory instinct, or sharing in the comraderie
of the camp is what we are left with, throw in conservation reasons if you want, but John Q Public does things for himself & thats who you need to convince that hunting for the pure joy of it is worth while.
And it's not just hunting traditions that are dwindling by the way, how many empty ball fields & frozen ponds do we all pass all the time, and all ya gotta do to use them is go use them.
But J.Q.P. does not come away from the T.V. for just anything, and if it involves effort ........
BACK to the question asked, we need to get more kids interested early, by somehow getting them either into archery or orienteering, and just like crack, if we get them hooked, they will come back for more, and bring their freinds.
The AANS site just reposted the ARCHERY IN SCHOOLS thread, which has had very little online support IMO, but could be a great stepping stone towards increasing hunters numbers.
Another thread a while back on NSH.COM talked of a mentoring program, and i'll repeat one of Bill Jordans of show closing lines " IF you can, please take a child hunting or fishing with you".... and not just a child, take anyone you think might 'get it'.
It's sort of unfortunate that the part alot of us like about hunting is the solitude though, and encouraging others to tag along is often considered counter productive to the hunt, but must be done if we actually want to bolster our ranks.

sorry for the long winded post,,, but you asked

[POINTY STICKS]

Well it may have been long winded to you but this is the type of thing that needs to be done. I have seen the Archery in schools post both on the AANS site and the NSH site. And your right they don't seen to get a lot of support. My 6 year old loves to shoot his bow,and his older sister can be coaxed into it when she feels the desire. I had a thought the other night ,which i am not prepared to discuss at this time, but my idea is not new and could very easily make it easier for more people to have easy access to this sport in this Province. It would take a couple of years to get the word out and get set up but if it works everybody in the archery field would benefit .

[ironfistcanada]

Bill Dockendorff of PEI had 125 kids show up to see an archery demonstration put on by him on the island 2 weeks ago. All the kids got to shoot and they had a blast. They contacted Boyscouts and youth groups. I have had archery courses in the Bedford firehall with my son Tom helping and the response was great. We also taught a group of Wolf Cubs. The problem with this is that the kids never get beyond this type of education there is no way for them to get to a shoot or to an event. I could fill my van with kids at every shoot . Thats easy but their parents or guardians on the whole will not help out. Maybe more parents could get involved when an instructor informs them that their kid has an interest. As soon as tou tell them they have to have their own equipment its game over. Everything is cool when somebody like us is providing them with arrows and all the neccessary gear. How many youngsters out there would love to do what we do but cant because of parent apathy or simply the lack of funds. ,logistics and the like. I have made bows and given away numerous and those kids never get to shoots, they have no way of getting there and it dies. AS far as mentoring goes we can only have so many kids under our wings and if we have our own then its even harder. What we do need is more volunteers who can help out and thats a start. But we might be the only way those kids can ever participate in the sport. Even young adults are finding it hard to get to shoots vehicle insurance and gas prices among other things stop them. I have 2 sons that are interested in shooting but they both work every weekend and cant get to the shoots let alone hunting. Some of us are lucky we can do it, There are thousands who cant. John.

[huntwisely]

With the introduction of the gun registry, a lot of the older wiser hunters couldn't be bothered with the BS and sort of dropped out of hunting. Over the years, the doe tag system has reduced numbers as folks said "if they didn't get a doe tag, they weren't going to even bother hunting" as the chances of seeing a buck were a lot slimmer than seeing a doe.

Then the combinations of forestry practices, too much easy access to the back country via the new woods roads, the heavy snow/coyote combination all contributed to lower deer populations. Now - if you have ever taken a kid hunting or fisshing, you know that if they don't see or catch naything, they lose interest. DO this a few times in a row and the TV looks better and better. hat why we have Bass fishing - so kids of all ages can catch something every time they go.

I believe that that the BOW program should be aimed at Jr and Sr high gurls and at a cheap rate, not the middle age yuppie girl that it currently seems to target.

The hunter safety or bowhunter safety course should be taken to the schools, as well as a part of the biology program being a course study with the DNR' s input on game management explaing why hunting is such an invaluable tool. It would curtail some of the negatives that some teachers inadventently push acroos to the students.

[POINTY STICKS]

You have some interesting points HW, but to teach some of those in the school system just would never work. You seem to forget that not everybody feels that hunting and fishing do any more that needlessly harm helpless critters. There has to be a program which allows both children and adults to get into the woods. There is no need to push the hunting and fishing part of the equation. That is a personal choice. If you can get 500 people in the woods, who are interested in going camping a couple times a year at someplace like Kedgee they they will learn about the woodlands and habitat. If you take those trips and introduce the facts in the right way to show that hunting and fishing are useful TOOLS in conservation and game management then you stand a chance. You know as well as I that people are slow on taking up and in new info. You can't force anybody to believe Joe nobody over night when so many celebrities are on the anti band wagon. After in the eyes of the young and impressionable they are gods and can do now wrong. It's a bad message that is sent out about this type of thing and in todays world I can sit in the living room and play hunting video games which are very realistic and never leave the couch. Oh and some of those games are just as hard if not harder than the real thing. I think that you have to get them in the woods before you can teach them about what we as hunter can do to support the woodlands and different wildlife. Most people have no idea as to what could and would happen if the hunters were not there to help manage wildlife in this province. But as more and more spring bears are shot on the door step, I think they will slowly get the message. There are a lot of people who do not associate the fact that as hunters we eat what we harvest. It's not just left in the woods to rot. No if they start to push for anti hunting in this province then I'm going to start to protest the mass production of domestic farm animals which are slaughtered each day just to put meat on the table of some lazy ass who thinks its wrong to go out and try and hunt something. Those big dumb stupid cow and stuff have no idea that the next trip in a truck will be their last. At the very least the deer and bears have the free will and brains to to run away when things don't seem right. I don't know if any of this makes sence but it's the way I look at it.

[POINTY STICKS]

Ironfist maybe A2 and the boys in the valley have the right approach. If not getting it into the schools as an extra then how could you get it introduced as a after school thing. In the fall and spring it could just as easily be done on the track and Field area as it could be done inside. I think that the hard part would be to get archery clubs to get get the equipment and volunteers together to do it. It would be a lot of work which most of us don't have the time to put into but the biggest thing would be to get the equipment gathered up to get enough for say a half dozen students to try the first year. After you get six students to follow through for a year then both you and their parents would know that a small investment would not be a waist of money. Put this together with a work shop which would teach how to both make a bow and arrows, which would demonstrate just how inexpensive it could be and you are teaching both wood working skills and archery. If this were done in a step program where say grade 10 was inexpensive bows and arrows supplied for the course. Then say grade 11 they learn to make their stuff as well as shoot it, followed by grade 12 they get an introduction into the higher tech compounds and fita type setups. It could be something which would work. If you could put this together so that at the end of the school year the instructors and students went on a 3-4 day camping trip where they could be introduced to the great outdoors, all this may just stick with them in their years to come. If they aren't interested at that point in time then sometime down the road they are at least prepped to pick it back up again. The big thing is that the seed has to be planted at a young age. It could take many years but they will come back to it. Most of my fondest family memories were of camping trips, thats what got me in the outdoors, and the family tradition of hunting is what got me hunting. I was just going back over your post and I'm thinking that if WE the archery community were to get together and do up a promotional video which would show all aspects of archery,and have some footage from the shoots to show what we do and how much fun it can be to go and camp out with the family at one of these shot weekends it could go a long way to introducing the public to this little corner of the world Let them see what it's all about and the skill and fun levels that go along with. Heck they can do that on the coach in the winter and maybe get out to one to check it out. I went to a couple different shoots this year where people who were interested in archery came out to see what goes on. Now if you can get more people to come out to see out of curiosity then you will have maybe more people who will at the least want to try

[alpo]

Not much here to dis-agree with...
I saw a freind at the rink, whose boy has asked me for a bow several times, and told him about the Primitive Bow Building course at Glooscap. He balked at the idea of going before he even knew the times... frustrating, when you know the kid is interested, and the opportunity is there, but no support from Mom & Dad. (excuse being already spread thin with other things)
I have disscussed the Intro sessions with some of the Glooscap members also & they echoed what Ironfist said, they will come until they need to make a commitment to it.
I agree that it would be hard to get hunter saftey taught during class time, but i think if there were a way to get a course(s) taught in a after shcool program, same as all other sports that folks are into, then there might be a few new hunters that would otherwise have never had or taken the oppertunity to get certified.

[huntwisely]

They have "Exploratories:" in the Jr. High here, allowing kids to do things they have never done before or want to do. These things include swimming, mountain biking, etc, so ther e is now reson except the lack of instructors that hunter safety couldn't be done.

[POINTY STICKS]

HW you can't go into the school system and teach hunter safety. That would mean that the school board would have to be willing to encourage a blood sport. Can't see it ever happening. Today society would have you out on your ass faster than you could blink. You have to remember that hunting is being more and more frowned upon each year. I'm suggesting getting more youth into archery not hunting. Start with what the sweet little moms and the dads will tolerate. The last thing you want to do is get the local community all a buzz over teaching hunting in schools cause then all you'll get is some upper Canadian crying over it. Next you'll have all the Sunday shoppers crying foul and some movie star speaking out against it. No you have to promote archery and the out doors they rest would have to be a choice that the individuals make. If you teach it they will stay.

[alpo]

now there is something to disagree with, IF you are only trying to get archery in schools, then you /we should ally ourselves with AANS & get more of their support & ideas to impliment such venture, as you stated above when mentoining A2 (Ricky C), BUT that same division of philosophy would just begin at a younger age.
Not that AANS is anti hunting, but if your asking how to promote hunting, why would you try & evade the battle for the sake of a few potential antis?
I think that teaching kids early that hunting is more sustainable and more traditional and just as valid a recreation as any other. It is a sport that one can participate in, at ones own pace and comfort level for a lifetime. Please don't leave out the part where ya get to eat some great food that tastes even better knowing exactly what went into putting it on the table. BY ALL MEANS teach archery, but don't fail to defend & promote hunting in the process.

[POINTY STICKS]

I just don't think that to promote it as hunting would work. You would have to put some kind of softer heading on it. Call it out door survival would be better excepted than hunting ,but hey I've been wrong before and I'm not afraid to admit that. Yes you could then push all aspects of the outdoor life. Hunting camping fishing trapping hiking canoing etc that way it could cover it all,maybe break it down into the sub categories to allow the kids to chose what they are interested in. I believe that if you can get them into the woods and having fun then they can make the choice to hunt or fish. But you have to give them the skills to be there and teach them just how much the outdoors life has to offer. They will pick it up as we did. Your right the we don't need a bunch of archers running through the woods, but it may help all aspects if there were alot of youngsters introduced to the outdoors. If the funding thing is a problem how many companies would make donations to help get the kids out into the woods and off the couch. that could be a was to help support it and get it moving on a private level.

[huntwisely]

But you guys seemed top have missed the part where as part of the Biology field trips and classes to engage DNr to help promote that hunting is the biggest part of game management and game management is bettering the herds or species

[alpo]

I did not miss that part HW, I just still do not agree that it is realevant to the question asked.
as in, after i learned that plumbing is a nessecary part of living, i still had no desire to become a plumber. I'll admit & accept that I need that service to be done by THEM. ( no offence to any plumbers) So it's not a major step towards increasing interest in hunting, simply pointing out that we need someone doing it.
But i do agree how hunting is used as a tool, how it has & will contribute to habitat protection , refirbishment & enhancement...ect....
I really think your onto something too, with the targeting of teen age
women with the BOW program. And that model or something like it offered to the boys as well, who may not be getting that at home or wherever.... but we have to let them know how much fun it is somehow.

[huntwisely]

Whether or not the kid decides to hunts is less important than knowing that it is a valuable tool and a necessity is the critters are going to flourish. My son has had teachers that bash hunting as cruel and unnecessary as they seem to belive that the critters all exist as they do in Walt Disney. Then of course young boys have the peer pressure of young girls not to hunt.

As far as archery as an exploratory, liability seems to be the reason the schools won't / don't offer it even though some have the equipment. Perhaps Boy Scouts - which also have fewer and fewer members or 4 H would be a good place to start.

Corse parents are a lot to blame as well - Doug at Hnatiuks did 2 polar bear mounts and put them on the front lawn one day recently. It took less than an hour for some woman to call and complain that it was disgusting, etc. SO, Doug did they honourable thing and brough them indoors out of sight. I think I would have suggested thay she get stuffed myself.