Cross bow

[POINTY STICKS]

Since I always seem to have porblems posting on the NSH site ,I thouhgt I would bring this topic over here.A2 posted a thread over there concerning Cross Bows in the general bowhunting season. Seem the many of the state bowhunting organizations have been to a summit where this was discussed. I know that last year this topic was raised in the province of Nova Scotia,and was put to rest for the time being. As bowhunters in htis province it's time that we sit down and figure out the plan of action for when this topic comes to center stage again. I have heard some arguements both for and against putting them in the bowhunting season. My personal view is to put them in the rifle season if they must be put anywhere at all. They only seem to have a string in common with bows. Now I'll admit that I have a short history with bow,and bowhunting but, I know of no archers who would place a stock ,safety or trigger on their bows. Ok maybe you could call some of the mechanical releases used for compounds triggers,but they are not mounted as part of the weapon. Archers have to draw their bows and hold them at draw until released,not so with cross bows. Seem that the closer you look the more they look like a rifle with a string on it . OK I started this now its your guys turn to exp[ress your views on this topic. I maybe wrong with my view ,but it is mine and I am the only person that it represents .

[huntwisely]

Personally = I think if they are allowed in Nova Scotia, it should not be for hunting. use them only at a range, like handguns. There is no reason to allow them in the woods, other than some dealers think they would make more money by selling more stuff

[alpo]

Does part of the attraction for hunters have something to do with no registration? like we do with bows. or are they just after the extended season?

[POINTY STICKS]

The lack of registration could have something to do with it. I wonder if the were put into the restricted catagroy if there would be as many people willing to use them. You can get them small enough to hold with one hand as is done with a pistol. Still don't like the rise to your shoulder air and pull the trigger .It even sounds too much like long gun.

[alpo]

same as A2 requested over on the NSH.COM site.... Does BANS have an official stance or position on the crossbow issue ? And is there any local groups or users asking for them to be legalized in Nova Scotia?

[POINTY STICKS]

Yes to all those questions Alpo. BANS does have an official stance on the issue . It's safe to say that BANS is not for the introduction of the Xbow. And I know little about this, but the issue was addressed at the federation meeting this year and was put down. It would seem that it is the manufactures and the seller that are pushing for it here as it's "NEW MARKETS". I have my own beleifs on this issue and they may not be the same as anybodies but I 'm not for them.

[ironfistcanada]

Interesting message . Do any of you know anyone who actually wants to use a Crossbow?. Do we know of anyone who wants to use a crossbow and use our seasons . Has there been a valid test on these weapons conducted here. Are they an efficient tool to harvest wildlife.?? Many States and I believe a couple of provinces seem to believe they are fit to use in the woods. Is there a specific group lobbying the DNR or legal channels to legalize the Crossbow for hunting purposes. Lots of crossbow bashing , there always seems to have been. Interesting post Deerjackn. HW you say" there is no reason to allow them in the woods." well maybe somebody wants to hunt with one, just like we like to hunt with our Traditional bows and arrows. Nobody stopped the compounders going into the woods and hunting. I dont want one , I wont own one and of course I wont hunt with one.But thats my opinion.

[huntwisely]

Ironfist

My personal opinion is that there are a large number of rifle hunters that do not support or at best are neutral regarding bow hunting, have many misconceptions about bow hunting or resent bow hunters having an early season. A small number of these MAY pick up at cross bow, but I feel it will alienate even more of the remainder and make it difficult to get bow hunting issues through the Federation. having said that, and after many evenings spent researching various State and Provincial sites regarding crossbow usage, and reviewing lots of statistics, I found these snippets interesting. Try googling up some for yourself.

When first allowed in some areas they were for handicapped hunters only but in a few years found their way into the archery seasons of various states.

In Canada some crossbows are restricted weapons. There was a ripple to have the others registered, which is only one step away from registering all bows.

Some states are now trying to get rid of them after allowing them for several years due to increase injury stats ( reported in the archery seasons and other reasons.)

It was found that few additional hunters entered the woods with crossbows, but it allowed rifle hunters to easily access the extended archery seasons where cross bows were allowed in archery seasons, therefore increasing pressure on herds.

One of the reasons bow hunters have extended seasons, etc, is lower success rates. With crossbows it was found that the success rates went up. This could put some of our hard won privileges at risk.

Yes there are studies galore you can find if you do various searches.

[alpo47]

Sorry for missing the meeting, and then asking for updates... but what was the outcome of the meeting reguarding X-bows ?
Were there many members or guests on the PRO side of this issue ?
I fully agree that there would be no new hunters drawn to the sport simply because of the addition of X-bows

[buckknife]

I have no interest in crossbows ,or hunting with one,but is there some disabled hunters that are trying to have them introduced here?,or is it crossbow manufactures?I wonder how many would have a different opinion on them if they were very interested in bowhunting,bbut just could not use a bow?For those who are not disabled,i would say no to them using a x-bow .

[POINTY STICKS]

I don't know BK, I can't see any body who is disabled choosing a xbow over a firearm. Then how do you classify disabled, in medical terms I have a permanent medical disability. This doesn't mean that I would want one,or use one. If my recurve ever became to much to handle when I could always go to a compound with a let off. If I couldn't use one of those then a fire stick would be my personal next step, due to the fact that I would not only have effective power for the task but, I could then add to the distance in which I would be able to successfully fill my tag. Looking at some of the reports which can be found on line they do not paint them all rosie. Many of the Archery related hunting groups in States which now have them are opposed. Since they have been introduce the number of hunting related injuries has risen, on top of this depending on which group is asked the effective range changes. In some cases the States themselves have removed them.

[huntwisely]

If a person was disabled - then some one else would have to thingy it (probably) as if he was able to thingy it, he could probably pull a compound. Most cross bows today are virtually compounds mounted horizontally on a stock. Instead of an arrow rest they have a channel for the arrow (can't remember the correct term) and intead of a portabable trigger (a release), they have a fixed trigger.

Now we would have to have classes of disabled hunter card. One for those with motor or cardio-vascular problems forcing them to hunt from a vehicle and one for those that are mobile but can't pull a bow.

Sounds like a real potentail can of worms

[POINTY STICKS]

Here is part of a release from the NY Bowhunters Association. Although not related to this site in any way I though it was interesting to read what is said and how different sections of the archery world see the crossbow issue

NATIONAL BOWHUNTER EDUCATION FOUNDATION

The International Bowhunter Education Program (IBEP) is a program designed and administered by the National Bowhunter Education Foundation (NBEF) to train Bowhunters throughout North America and the world.

The IBEP definition of a bow is one that is hand held, hand drawn, and released with nothing attached to the bow that will allow the bow to be mechanically held in a drawn or thingyed position. Therefore, the crossbow is not a bow and should not be considered for use in any "bowhunting only" season.

The NBEF does not offer an educational program for any hunting device except the bow and arrow, and recommends that if states and provinces approve the crossbow for hunting that it's use be restricted to the firearms' seasons.


CORNELL UNIVERSITY SURVEY

A 1995 survey titled Evaluation of Proposals For Change In Deer Hunting Regulation conducted by Cornell University at the request of the New York State Department of Environmental Conservation concluded that "hunters generally do not support the use of the crossbow."

When deer hunters were asked if they were in support of the use of crossbows during the regular firearms season three quarters of the respondents (75.5%) said their satisfaction would change. Of those a majority (68.2%) said their satisfaction would decrease if the crossbow were allowed and most of the hunters (87.1%) said their satisfaction would greatly decrease.

Copies of the survey can be obtained from the Human Dimensions Research Unit, Department of Natural Resources, Cornell University, Ithaca, N.Y. 14853-3001

THE POPE & YOUNG CLUB

The Pope and Young Club (P&Y)was founded to promote bowhunting and to record for posterity the outstanding examples of North American big game animals taken solely with the hunting bow.

A hunting bow is defined as a longbow, recurve, or compound bow that is handheld and hand drawn, and that has no mechanical device to enable the hunter to lock the bow at full or partial draw, other than the energy stored by the drawn bow, no device to propel the arrow will be permitted.

The P&Y Club does not consider the crossbow to be a hunting bow and will not accept any trophies collected by crossbow hunters. Furthermore, the club considers the use of the crossbow during bowhunting seasons to be a serious threat to the future of bowhunting.

Therefore the club recommends that the crossbow not be considered for use in any bowhunting only season. The club strongly recommends that crossbow hunting be abolished from all existing bowhunting only seasons and the use of the crossbow for hunting be restricted to firearms' seasons.

For more information contact the Pope & Young Club, 6471 Richard Avenue, Placerville, California 95667


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THE PROFESSIONAL BOWHUNTERS SOCIETY

The Professional Bowhunters Society (PBS) is opposed to the use of any weapon, other than those bows drawn, held and released by hand, in any archery-only season.

Furthermore, PBS is opposed to the creation of any new hunting season or the extension of any existing hunting season which will decrease the length of the archery-only hunting season or displace the archery-only season into less favorable dates. While PBS recognizes and supports the rights of hunters who choose to use other weapons in separate hunting seasons, we will oppose any efforts to establish hunting seasons where the ultimate aim is inclusion in the archery-only season.

Bowhunting was meant to be, and is a difficult and demanding sport. It requires a high level of dedication from its participants. Today's modem compound bows, coupled with sight pins and mechanical releases, have done much to make it easier for archers to reach and maintain levels of proficiency necessary for hunting. Unfortunately, there are still those sportsmen and women who are not willing to put forth the time and effort to learn to shoot archery equipment proficiently. The crossbow is the answer for today's opportunistic hunter who lacks the dedication and commitment required to be a bowhunter. The crossbow is simply a superior weapon that is much easier to use than archery equipment.

For more information contact the Professional Bowhunters
THE MULLANEY REPORT

Mr. Norb Mullaney, a professional engineer, is recognized as the leading authority on the physics of bows and endows. He states that "The hand held bow has one characteristic that distinguishes it from a crossbow or any type of firearm. The internal ballistics are a function of the shooter, his or her physical geometry and capabilities, shooting form, consistency and reaction to stress and trauma. In the crossbow and firearms, the internal ballistics are fixed. The action of the shooter in triggering a release of energy does nothing more than initiate a process that is consistent and repetitive. The hand held bow is different. Every action of the shooter contributes something either positive or negative to the interior ballistic process. As the interior ballistics vary, so do the exterior ballistics. Shooting the hand held bow and arrow is much more complicated than aiming a fixed system of ballistics and touching off the energy discharge. The total energy to draw, hold and release the bow must come directly and unassisted from the shooter's muscle power."

Copies of the Mullaney Report can be obtained from Mr. Mullaney, Engineer, Writer, 8425 North Greenvale Rd. Milwaukee W/ 53217



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[superdave]

Thank You
Pointy Stick
That is very good information ,well I guess we as concerned hunters here in Nova Scotia are not that far off when it comes to this issue.
One thing is for sure bowhunting and archery is on the rise in N.S.
with more youth taking and interests as well.
This is all thanks to the Bowhunting instructors and the many archery club and firearm safety instructors in N.S.
I would like to see the show of hand at there annual general meeting of who is in favor of Cross bows for hunting big game in N.S. My guess is not many at all.
There, so forget about it no crossbows and that it.
Regard and sorry to the want to be`s.

[ArcheryMan]

The bowhunting in this province was achieved by a strong group of archers. It was not an easy task because of the opposition from the rifle hunters and others at the table(NSFAH).
Are there any X-gun clubs in the province that want to bring their requests to the table?
There are many disabled archers. So the question remains, what type of disablity does it take to require the use of a X-gun?